Arguing about former , current and future managers thread

Blah blah blah... say whatever you like. I know what I know. I know what I've been told. You can sit there and huff and puff but deep down you know I'm right and it eats away at you. You know by mid July you'll have no more excuses to wheel out and hide behind. I can take whatever you throw at me because I know by then I'll be vindicated and then we'll see who can use the word pathetic.

Read the J.D interview in the leader and see what he does not say. His silence on the current manager says all you need to know.

fone you are correct of course. Be careful though what you say as the Ryanites will be on your case. Their time is however nearly at and end.

And last year in the championship we suffered the most humiliating defeat in living memory before going out at what stage? Quarter final it was not, in a way we were better off not having to get humiliated in Croke park by Meath again which was highly likely. If this is all we can manage this year then ok. However a Leinster final spot would be an improvement on last year.

Sure Moyes got to spend close to 70 million on two lads he probably didn't need.

Even McGeeney got to bring in Seanie.

Meanwhile poor Jason Ryan has to deal with the retirement of arguably the greatest player to ever to pull on a Kildare jersey.

Although as it's now being reported that Moyes found out he'd lost his job through social media reports before the club contacted him, maybe he's more like McGeeney than Ryan.

jasus lads i never heard so much b/s**t in my life. In 2010 after our defeat to Louth most people were calling for Geezers head. I think Ryan has inherited a much maligned and poor squad who are in need of change and overhaul which he is doing at present. This is not a soccer club on a stock exchange with investors demanding results . Its GAA FFS and we all need to clam down and stop acting like a bunch of soccer heads . Obviously none of you have  any experience of training , mentoring , coaching and have the required people skills to manage a team.

Baba have you definitive proof he has lost the dressing room . Are you a player or close to a player. If so more dribble i've had it with this crap

murof wrote:

Baba O' Reily wrote:

murof wrote:

Baba, what proof have you that " a large percentage of the support never wanted him and some players are not happy with him."
By the way if we draw Cavan, Limerick and Fermanagh in the qualifiers we would have a good chance of reaching a Q/F imo.

Kildare would not beat Cavan so you can forget about that.

As for proof show me where the proof is I'm wrong and I'm hardly going to name players am I. Be safe in the knowledge quite a few don't rate him near in the class of the previous manager no matter how much you want them to. 

Pathetic attempt at providing some proof. You clearly don't know anything other than your own dislike of Ryan.

Murof Baba makes a fair few points there and I've heard a couple of things from the county lads in my club that they are not happy with and its not far off what baba is saying. Johnny leaving half way through the year is a very strange one too, would Johnny have left if he thought we were going to win a leinster.

[quote="murof"][quote="Baba O' Reily"]

murof wrote:

Baba, what proof have you that " a large percentage of the support never wanted him and some players are not happy with him."
By the way if we draw Cavan, Limerick and Fermanagh in the qualifiers we would have a good chance of reaching a Q/F imo.

Kildare would not beat Cavan so you can forget about that.

As for proof show me where the proof is I'm wrong and I'm hardly going to name players am I. Be safe in the knowledge quite a few don't rate him near in the class of the previous manager no matter how much you want them to. 

This comment is unreal PM me with names and I will believe you . This is like gutter journalism . If some players aren't happy they are not getting a game or dont like a challenge and hence dont deserve to be part of any county set up.

Westside, JD leaving had absolutely nothing to do with Ryan, he made that clear in his radio interview and was annoyed that some people had tried to link the two.
As for JD not leaving if he thought we would win leinster, maybe the presence of Dublin in the final might have made anyone think twice.
I accept that Ryan has been a disappointment so far but we didn't get rid of McGeeeney after he got us relegated or even after he lost to Wicklow so surely Ryan deserves the same chance.

Baba O' Reily wrote:

murof wrote:

Baba, what proof have you that " a large percentage of the support never wanted him and some players are not happy with him."
By the way if we draw Cavan, Limerick and Fermanagh in the qualifiers we would have a good chance of reaching a Q/F imo.

Kildare would not beat Cavan so you can forget about that.

As for proof show me where the proof is I'm wrong and I'm hardly going to name players am I. Be safe in the knowledge quite a few don't rate him near in the class of the previous manager no matter how much you want them to. 
Hell even J.D in his interview in the leader this week said as much between the lines. Funny he said McGeeney was the best manager he ever played under but never had one word for Ryan. 

Fone as I have always said you sack a manager to improve. So to stay on par we need to reach a quarter final this year, Leinster final and quarter final next year and a semi final the year after. That's the level he has to aspire to. Anything less is a backward step and a failure. 
But he won't be here in three years, he won't be here in two years. He won't be here in six months so I've no need to worry.

Hardly going to mention him as one of best managers he played under given he played a total of about 10 minutes for him .....

Plus he was captain for 5 years under Kieran so I'm sure he learned a lot from him.

jj wrote:

Baba O' Reily wrote:

murof wrote:

Baba, what proof have you that " a large percentage of the support never wanted him and some players are not happy with him."
By the way if we draw Cavan, Limerick and Fermanagh in the qualifiers we would have a good chance of reaching a Q/F imo.

Kildare would not beat Cavan so you can forget about that.

As for proof show me where the proof is I'm wrong and I'm hardly going to name players am I. Be safe in the knowledge quite a few don't rate him near in the class of the previous manager no matter how much you want them to. 
Hell even J.D in his interview in the leader this week said as much between the lines. Funny he said McGeeney was the best manager he ever played under but never had one word for Ryan. 

Fone as I have always said you sack a manager to improve. So to stay on par we need to reach a quarter final this year, Leinster final and quarter final next year and a semi final the year after. That's the level he has to aspire to. Anything less is a backward step and a failure. 
But he won't be here in three years, he won't be here in two years. He won't be here in six months so I've no need to worry.

Hardly going to mention him as one of best managers he played under given he played a total of about 10 minutes for him .....

So funny how people can treat one lad's word as gospel when it suits them but use 'reading between the lines' instead of what he has actually said, which is that Jason Ryan had nothing to do with him packing it in, that he had been treated beyond fairly by Jason Ryan, that Jason Ryan wanted to have him in his championship team and that Jason Ryan deserved the support of the players, county board, supporters club and supporters.

And having to reach a quarter-final is bollix. You're talking history, not recent form. You're talking a different team actually. Kildare are not in the top eight and they weren't last year either. The same reasons I defended McGeeney last year exist this year. You can't have two different sets of criteria, again, to suit your thinking.

Look - I wish McGeeney was still there. He isn't. But he would be having difficulties now too because you're having to try to get that culture into a new group - and there are the injuries. The squad was in the wrong division. But I would say Darroch Mulhall mightn't have gotten his chance if McGeeney WAS still around. And he's done well.

Anyone who thinks in absolutes, one way or the other, tends not to have an accurate handle on things. These things are much more shades of grey (don't go there) than black and white.

Ogie wrote:

These things are much more shades of grey (don't go there) than black and white.

Wash yer mouth ya filthy beggar................. oh and good post

at moment in kildare gaa

the kildare county board is divided


some of senior players are unhappy with things in senior set up

fone wrote:

at moment in  kildare gaa

the kildare county board is  divided

WHAT !!!!! SURELY THIS CAN NOT BE TRUE. NEVER. UNHEARD OF.....   

The squad was in the wrong Division was it. Jesus didn't see the free "you're not good enough but we'll let you stay" pass they got last year to play Div 1 football. Must have imagined that league semi final appearance.
Only one thing bollix here.

As for talking History. Ryan will be judged on his results compared to McGeeney. That's how you judge whether he was a better option. At the moment he is an unmitigated disaster.
Darroch Mulhall got a chance with McGeeney. He never took it simple as. If his attitude was a little better McGeeney may have taken him seriously.

As fone said players are not happy. I'm surprised you haven't heard as you seem to suggest you have the inside track. 
We had lads on here using James Kavanagh as a stick to beat McGeeney. Well there are a few sticks being shaped for Ryan. We'll see if they are as eager to use them on their own man.

Kildare GAA is at a low point not seen since the mid 00's everywhere you look there is division. There is no one strong enough to bring it together. Basically we are up a creak without a paddle. The football is awful, the administration is awful and the support is dwindling.

Peter Whyte must be happy though as his monthly moan in the Nationalist has stopped.

baby o reily ur some toss pot ,dictator is gone get over it and hes taken every cent up north with him

jobluts wrote:

baby o reily ur some toss pot ,dictator is gone get over it and hes taken every cent up north with him

Are idiotic posts like this likely to be the norm on this forum into the future?

jobluts wrote:

baby o reily ur some toss pot ,dictator is gone get over it and hes taken every cent up north with him

You know you are on the right road when this is the level of response. I'll take it as a compliment jobluts, but it shows up your level of intellect. The crayons you use are not to be eaten.

Baba O' Reily wrote:

The squad was in the wrong Division was it. Jesus didn't see the free "you're not good enough but we'll let you stay" pass they got last year to play Div 1 football. Must have imagined that league semi final appearance.
Only one thing bollix here.

As for talking History. Ryan will be judged on his results compared to McGeeney. That's how you judge whether he was a better option. At the moment he is an unmitigated disaster.
Darroch Mulhall got a chance with McGeeney. He never took it simple as. If his attitude was a little better McGeeney may have taken him seriously.

As fone said players are not happy. I'm surprised you haven't heard as you seem to suggest you have the inside track. 
We had lads on here using James Kavanagh as a stick to beat McGeeney. Well there are a few sticks being shaped for Ryan. We'll see if they are as eager to use them on their own man.

Kildare GAA is at a low point not seen since the mid 00's everywhere you look there is division. There is no one strong enough to bring it together. Basically we are up a creak without a paddle. The football is awful, the administration is awful and the support is dwindling.

Peter Whyte must be happy though as his monthly moan in the Nationalist has stopped.

Now that IS bollix. I never said that. Not even when I had a closer handle on things. Right now, I have absolutely no track at all, having been working in other areas and not covering Kildare much at all.

I would expect there to be unhappiness. Johnny Doyle said there was plenty of it at times during Geezer's reign too. Bad results cause that. But JD also says Geezer was a brilliant manager, the best he's had, and should have been kept on. Like I said, plenty of grey.

Like JD also said, confidence is clearly affected. I stand by my assertion that an under-strength Kildare were bound to struggle in Division 1. And by my assertion that Kildare weren't top eight last year and aren't this year. But that's just an opinion and I know it counts for nothing.

I presume jobluts is a troll and I wouldn't count him as indicative of anything only ignorance. And I mean that in the most literal term of the word, because what he has posted is pure lies and chooses to ignore the huge tranches of revenue Kieran McGeeney generated directly and indirectly for Kildare GAA.

Some thoughts now that the dust has settled on the league and we're all still tearing strips off each other...

Oddly, although I wasn't in favour of his appointment, I do actually like the way Jason Ryan has Kildare trying to play. Fundamentally, I like to see attacking football and it's good to see Kildare playing in that way. However, there's something not right at the moment. Whether Ryan isn't getting the best out of the players or they simply aren't working hard enough, we're not where we need to be. I actually thought we should have survived in Division One this year - we were capable of beating Kerry at home and the Tyrone loss was criminal.

Looking at the overall picture, I would like to see the county board put in a place a system whereby there is a conveyor belt of managers a la Dublin, and also it would be heartening if they took serious steps to address the county's debt. However, you can never quite escape the feeling that they're making up as they go along - hence the Geezer sacking without an obvious outstanding replacement - and so I'm not exactly filled with confidence that these steps will be taken.

There is great work being done at underage level and we have some very talented young players coming through, which makes it all the more galling that the county structures aren't right. I wasn't convinced by the appointment of Tom Cribbin to manage the U21s, and I'm sorry, but their performance this year was a disgrace. If we're serious about becoming a real force and competing with the Dublins, Mayos, Corks, Kerrys and Tyrones of the world, and not just being perennial underachievers, then performances like that are simply unacceptable, end of. As for the minors, Hackett seems to have something about him, they're a talented group, and hopefully they can mount a title defence more credible than the U21s, which was abysmal.

I'd fancy us to win the first round game and then I think we are going to have a ferocious battle against Meath. They couldn't buy a win against us a few years ago, but unfortunately our performances lately suggest there isn't much at all between us at the moment, and we'll have our work cut out to beat them. If we get over them, I'd like to think we could give Dublin a right go, but if we're being honest, the likelihood is they would maul us again. Basically, I think the Dubs will walk Leinster, although I think that may catch up with them later in the year...

So perhaps the Chosen One will be the Wrong One and we'll have to take down that banner in Conleth's. Cue John McMahon flying in for talks with Paul Bealin. Actually, I probably shouldn't joke about it for fear of tempting fate... Anyway, roll on June 1!

"Hackett seems to have something about him"
Dont know how you can come up with that remark, we lost twice in the league and only beat a poor westmeath team by 4pts which could have easily gone the other way. At u16 level his team was beaten by offaly who went on to win the father manning cup and we only won the shield. He has a long way to go to prove himself yet

Exellent Post HG..
Your point on Managers is a good One and Dublin have shown why, with Dessie waiting to come in next..
Have We not got any talented Managers within the County ?, Hackett / Lacey, Murphy, McGeeney, J Ryan all outsiders, by the way the Jury is still out on Hackett, and some of the stuff Im hearing beggars belief, but we will leave that aside, and hopefully I will be wrong..

The U21s was an absolute disaster, and hopefully this will be addressed asap.

We were relagated, Donegal / Monaghan Promoted, the last 2 Ulster Champions and 1 AI, are We better than them ?, dont think so.. Are We ahead of Down, Laois, Meath or Armagh ?, If so only marginal..
We havent won a Leinster going on 14 Years, and We blame the Dubs in the main for this.. If We were in any of the other Provinces would We have faired any better ?, doubt it.

Ogie wrote:

Kildare are not in the top eight and they weren't last year either. The same reasons I defended McGeeney last year exist this year. You can't have two different sets of criteria, again, to suit your thinking.

I actually do think we were in the top eight last year. I couldn't come up with eight better teams in 2013 across the season. Can come up with seven maybe, not eight.

On a side note, was just from a cold, non-opinionated perspective going through Ryan's managerial record because we all remember 2008 and certain outings against Dublin, none of which were won. Couple of points on this, firstly let's not pretend his Wexford side were a group of bad footballers turned into something good as Masterson was a very good goalkeeper, Wallace a superb full-back, Morrissey and Morris two excellent wing-backs while Barry, Flynn, Lyng, Banville and Forde were amongst the forwards. Secondly, that 2008 year was remarkable as the county firstly got promoted to Division Two and reached a Leinster final and All Ireland semi-final. You cannot underplay that achievement but I was wondering what then and was that the exception, rule or in between?

Well in terms of the league, they didn't win a game the following season in Division Two and it took him three more campaigns to get them out of Division Three. As for championship football, in 2009 they lost a Leinster quarter-final and second round qualifier to Roscommon; in 2010 they again lost a Leinster quarter-final and lost a third-round qualifier to Cork kicking 0-5; in 2011 they reached the easiest Leinster final in history and lost their only qualifier to Limerick; while in 2012 they reached a Leinster semi-final and lost a second round qualifier to Tipperary.

I thought his tactics in several Dublin games were excellent even if he couldn't instill the steel in the team to get them over the line. But outside of that from 2009-2012, he won less than half of his championship games and aside from near-misses his championship victories in their totality were Offaly by one, Galway by one, Longford by one, and London, Offaly, Westmeath and Carlow well.

So 2008 exception or rule? And is there enough there to suddenly expect a change come summer and to give time to right the many wrongs thus far should this season turn into a write off?

Fair point about Tommy about the true worth of his achievements with Wexford. However the only reason he is in the Kildare job now is because of McGeeney. He saw something in him that could benefit Kildare and brought him on board.
Would he have been considered for the manager's job otherwise and would he have been interested in it if he was not already in the camp? I think I read somewhere that his ambitions lay outside of gaelic football and included hurling and soccer.

I'm not a huge contributor to the forum, but some of the slurry being spread is beyond belief.

First off, Kieran Mcgeeney did great things for Kildare football.  He brought a level of professioialism and preparation that was sorely lacking beforehand.  It's because of him that kildare fans now expect us to be challenging in division 1 and all Ireland quarter finals  However, the last 2 years of his tenure saw a stagnation, and even regretion in Kildare football.  Look at the All Ireland quarter final we played against Donegal, where we should have bet them off the park in extra time.  Look at the heights Donegal went to, while Kildare seemed to go backwards.  Tactically, I don't think Mcgeeney had the nouse to bring Kildare to the next level, and so I think a change was needed.

Baba, you seem to relish the thought of this Kildare team failing?  I looked back over previous threads and you were nowhere to be seen when Kildare were on the back of the Mayo win and a good O' Byrne cup.  Looks to me like you were just waiting for things to go wrong so you could go on the offensive.  You're arguments are completely totalitarian and you refuse to see any other pov that isn't ridiculous pro-mcgeeney propoganda.    

I think Ryan is trying to play the right brand of football, but we were just missing too many during the league. Bring peter kelly,leper, chalky and eoin doyle into the back line and we might have a bit more spine to us.  In particular we need a centre back, but I don't think there's one in the county?  Is it too much to give the man a year or two to bring his ideas in, with a group of young, talented footballers and see where it takes us?  I know a few of the lads on the panel and they seem to have a lot more confidence (in themselves) under him than they did under Mcgeeney.