Dublin v Kildare

That's the their problem Walter, they think those who saw what was coming down the tracks want Kildare to fail. They couldn't be further from the truth.
They wanted a change and now it's not working out how they expected they just use a scatter gun approach to their argument.
Oh murof show me where I insulted you as a I expect that little dig was directed at me and I'll aplogise. If you can't then I expect one in return.

You really expect nearly 90 years of neglect to be wiped out in seven? It got a whole lot better in that time. My point around the time McGeeney went was there were two distinct teams. He built 2008 to the highs of 09/10/11, and that team died a death in 2012 and he saw the need for a new team in 2013. It was then he introduced so much youth and aside from Dublin, we actually had a year better than we used to have with an established team - reaching league semi, rattling Tyrone, anyone remember thinking Cavan or Roscommon in a qualifier might be too much? Thus, given that, I thought who better to continue to look at underage, build a system, introduce new players and give it a go with team two. We were abject against Dublin last year, but who would you've more faith in now considering how close McGeeney got with time and team one to the best Dublin in years?

I only mention that because the majority in this county who actually did have an agenda saw that as not good enough, used the line that there wasn't enough progress and now I'd like to hear from them on weeks like this and throughout seasons like this. As I've said before, they shot people like me down at the time (not just people on the forum, I mean people throughout Kildare GAA.) They took a decision I believe will mean we will drift back into the pack of Laois and Monaghan and Cavan, and as I said after the under-21s the trend seems to be proving me right and tonight does it yet again.

And as this regression in place of promised progress continues (not people on the forum but rather what I believe to be a bunch of certain knuckle-dragging troglodytes that make key decisions in our county and I include certain from my own club)  I really, really, really want to hear from them as the season progresses. 41 scoring chances tonight? 10 point defeat? Relegation more of a prospect than last season? Under-21s out? Please speak up with the excuses that were not good enough a year ago when it came to a man that had taken a waste of a county so close and had plans to do so again!

Baba O' Reily wrote:

That's the their problem Walter, they think those who saw what was coming down the tracks want Kildare to fail. They couldn't be further from the truth.
They wanted a change and now it's not working out how they expected they just use a scatter gun approach to their argument.
Oh murof show me where I insulted you as a I expect that little dig was directed at me and I'll aplogise. If you can't then I expect one in return.

Who did?

I didn't want a change. My club voted against.

Get your facts right before throwing wild accusations around.

Taibi wrote:

Baba O' Reily wrote:

That's the their problem Walter, they think those who saw what was coming down the tracks want Kildare to fail. They couldn't be further from the truth.
They wanted a change and now it's not working out how they expected they just use a scatter gun approach to their argument.
Oh murof show me where I insulted you as a I expect that little dig was directed at me and I'll aplogise. If you can't then I expect one in return.

Who did?

I didn't want a change. My club voted against.

Get your facts right before throwing wild accusations around.

They being the majority of the county I think he means. As without a majority, we'd be better off! Democracy eh  

Calm down there lad. They as in those who wanted a change. Comprende.

Tommy, seriously, I was full square in opposition to McGeeney's treatment and felt he was due another year given the transition period that was required. But he was neither a saint nor god's gift to management. I grant you he elevated us to a level only Micko surpassed in the last 80 years, but there were some awful performances (including worse defensive ones than tonight if you want my opinion - you don't I know!) in 2012 and 2013 that you choose to ignore as well as some dreadful league displays even in the good years (Tyrone away, Monaghan away?) and a couple of our most embarrassing championship defeats. You talk about our appalling defence (and yes it is shite) but didn't those world beaters from Louth notch the same 1-22 against us in Navan one awful night in 2010? It's not as black and white as the trenchant views on here suggest. Revisionism on steroids.

Not even sure what to say but we were awful in the first half kinda got into it in the second half but then they came right back at us and when they ran at us we couldn't live with them. The full backs have to be changed when Peter Kelly and Ollie Lyons come back im not going to slag any players but change is needed there. We won fuck all ball in the middle in the first half off our own kickouts we need to sort out that or any good team is going to destroy us. Our half forwards should have tracked there runs too. The positive were we created the goal chances we need to be cuter and actually finish them. Negatives are out defensive frailties, Don't think Jason Ryan's in game management is good enough, get cut open by any run down the centre, and I don't think we will ever beat this Dublin side. Hope to god we can cut the gap when the likes of Eoin Doyle, Daryl Flynn, Peter Kelly Leper, Smith, Lynch, Lyons Niall Kelly, Johnny and Alan Smith come back but I live in hope!! On another note some Dublin fans are wankers!!

TK, Baba and WW are making out like the last two results are a slide into the abyss compared with the glory days of 2013.
We've gone from losing to Tyrone by six points to losing to Tyrone by a point, and from losing to Dublin by 13 points to losing to Dublin by 10 points.
Nineteen points behind those two sides this time last year, 11 now. I'll double check with my three-year-old niece on Skype later, but I'm confident that 19 is more than 11.


In case any adults want to discuss the game, well, it's always sickening to lose to Dublin and losing by a lot is far worse. I had hoped we'd lose by five or six at worst but the same problems as last year - we just can't avoid turnovers and their pace is too much for our defenders to handle.

I don't think kickouts were as bad as people make out and indeed we did very well on Cluxton's kick-out. Overall we lost 25-22 on kickouts and while that's not terrible we probably needed to dominate here to have any chance of winning the game.

The major positive for me is the invention and creativity in some of our attacking play. We created seven or eight goal chances. OK, Mulhall aside, the end product was muck, but it was a big improvement being the ones missing those goal chances rather than watching Dublin miss that many.

Anyway one of the advantages of being in Division One is you get to find out more about your players than you would in Div 2.

My thoughts:

Connolly: Limited kickout ability, once more heroic when it came to shot-stopping.
McGrillen: First couple of balls ok, nightmare after that.
Foley: Just looks too slow these days, hopefully will improve because if he doesn't, modern football has bypassed him.
O'Grady: Our best player. A revelation.
Murnaghan: Bad night but then it was a big step up marking McManamon in 2nd half. Wouldn't discard him over it.
K Cribbin: Got through a lot of ball but added little defensively.
P Cribbin: Anonymous in most of first half, flashes thereafter.
Moolick: Hard working but nowhere near as classy as Dublin's midfielders.
White: Too slow for this type of game, at midfield anyway.
McNally: Could have had three goals, still too hesitant, might be the one to make way for, say, Niall Kelly.
O'Flaherty: Super footballer.
Hurley: Really disappointing. I expected a lot more out of him.
Mulhall: Superb from play. Frees missed were difficult but they're the type Dublin get.
O'Connor: Useful when we put intelligent ball in, as we do under Ryan.
Brophy: In and out, but still so young, a leader of the future.

Imagine mulhall was in Kildare all the time mcgeeney was in the transfer market. Shows how much he believed in his team and the winning mentality he had that he concluded the only thing to do was to see where he could get a forward from anywhere. And then not to play him against Tyrone after he was one of the best forwards in the league?
Walter White calling names we all know what a class act you are, how do you make out people are small through this medium or is it that you are huge?
Back to the game.
At 4 points down in the second half we gave away two simple scores and missed a goal chance. Cork are a team that don't do that kind of stuff and the lads have to eradicate it from their game. Dublin were shaky at that point and the game could have been closer if we capitalised and did'nt hand Dublin an easy cushion after that the game was done. It was better than last years two efforts and not only on the scoreboard or am wrong?
Paudie o Neil is a bit rusty to say the least and surely Daryl Flynn is a better midfield option?
Hugh was poor again and made another basic error to lead to the goal. Hard to see much positives but it was an improvement on last year.

johnsmyth wrote:

Imagine mulhall was in Kildare all the time mcgeeney was in the transfer market. Shows how much he believed in his team and the winning mentality he had that he concluded the only thing to do was  to see where he could get a forward from anywhere. And then not to play him against Tyrone after he was one of the best forwards in the league?
Walter White calling names we all know what a class act you are, how do you make out people are small through this medium or is it that you are huge?
Back to the game.

As a matter of interest johnsmyth, what the hell are you talking about?

Who did I call names and what in the jasus are you talking bout when you say the word small?

It doesn't really matter who manages Kildare at the moment, Dubs are operating at a completely different level to us. The last 3 times we have played them we have lost by a combined total of 39 points, with last night being the closest we got. They had only 9 of their all-Ireland team last night, one of whom, Kilkenny went off after a minute so they will improve considerably for the summer. The reintroduction of Peter Kelly and Ollie Lyons should help us.
I would bring in Sean Campbell (I know I will be accused of bias!) and David Hyland for Foley and Hugh for next week. I know it is a huge game but I think it would be a bigger risk to start the two expierienced lads who are not performing at all at the minute.

Hasn't Dan Flynn played full back for JTB (or is that Luke?). With his pace and strength would he be a better option than the untried Campbell? Probably not Flynn's best position but maybe we need a square plug filling a rather large and leaky round hole at no 3 ?

What exactly do some on here expect?, Jason Ryan is currently tinkering with his team, I think he knows as much as the rest of us that his defense is by far his weakest link, McGeeneys defenses never had to play under the black card rule and as we all know on many occasion during his tenure they were often torn to shreds.

Even if we do get relegated its far from the end of the world but 2 wins out of 3 should be good enough to stay up, its not essential to play division one football as division two can be ultra competitive too, people seem to forget that we spent most of McGeeney's tenure in Division 2, it was he who got us relegated in the first place.
The league is never taken seriously by most teams, the Dubs have been experimenting throughout this league campaign as are the rest of the teams in the division including Kildare.

Basically none of the sides played or will play anything that closely resembles their championship line ups, so what exactly do you learn from each team playing experimental outfits against each other?.

The league is an opportunity for managers to learn about their own teams strength and weaknesses, blood new players, and try and shore up your weakest links as best as your panel of players allows you.

Personally I think Jason Ryan has done a pretty decent job so far, and I've taken much more positives from our recent performances than negatives wait till the Championship before the naysayers start sharpening their knives and if we have a Wicklow type debacle maybe you will be justified in sticking the knife in Ryan's back in his first season in charge.

If we were not sucker punched by Tyrone we would still now be holding out hopes of making the league semi final.

We're roughly in the same place as we were last year - lightyears behind the Dubs. Our main areas of weakness are fairly obvious and Ryan should be given time to work on those problem areas to attempt to bridge that gap, just like the time his predecessor was afforded. It's too early to give a proper assessment on Ryan's Kildare just yet. I see some positive developments but there is a lot of room for improvement in other aspects of our game.

Our defence requires major improvement. I made a case for McGrillen before the game but he just isn't cutting it at the moment, Foley likewise. I would agree with the suggestion that Hyland and Campbell should be given a go. I still don't think Hyland's long term future is in the full back line but it's getting to the stage where we have to try something else.

I was a bit surprised at the way we were set up tactically last night. Going man for man with the Dubs when we are missing some of our best defenders, the likelihood was that we would concede a big score. Maybe Jason Ryan didn't think he had time in training to implement a more defensive system, but it's something we need to work on for the championship. It's very unlikely we are going to beat any of the top sides in a shoot out.

I also thought we were very naive on our own kickouts. Shane Connolly was floating high kickouts to our midfielders who were trying to catch them cleanly, when all the Dubs were doing was breaking the ball away to their own man. I don't have the stats but it seems like the last few weeks that we have been losing the majority of our kickouts and a lot of these have directly led to scores.

On the occasions we did get the ball into our full-forward line, I thought we looked dangerous. Tomas and Darroch Mulhall did well here.

Daryl Flynn was not listed as a substitute last night. Does anyone know if he's injured or just gone out of favour? I think we could do with his experience around the midfield at the moment.

Thank God the dubs were only experimenting or 10 points would have been twenty. Standards are dropping all the time now it seems. Div 2 not all bad. After next week we'll have lads saying Div 2 is the place to be in order to rebuild.
We are not roughly in the same place, we are far worse off. Results wise, defensively wise and league position wise. Not to mention the U21's. To say otherwise is naive.

Ohtoootobe you better ask your niece is losing two matches better than losing two matches. My dog will tell me they are both the same. What I find laughable from you is that you are using 10 point defeat instead of a 13 point defeat to try a garner some kind of positive from yesterday's debacle.
There is not another County's supporters who would look at a result like that and think that's an improvement only ten points this time.. No wonder we are perennial losers.

Baba O' Reily wrote:

We are not roughly in the same place, we are far worse off. Results wise, defensively wise and league position wise. Not to mention the U21's. To say otherwise is naive.

That is not the case:

2013
Dublin 2-20 Kildare 2-7
Kildare 0-10 Tyrone 1-13
Cork 1-9 Kildare 2-10
Mayo 0-13 Kildare 1-11

2014
Dublin 1-22 Kildare 1-12
Kildare 1-21 Tyrone 3-16
Cork 0-16 Kildare 1-12
Kildare 2-19 Mayo 2-18

kickingking wrote:

Baba O' Reily wrote:

We are not roughly in the same place, we are far worse off. Results wise, defensively wise and league position wise. Not to mention the U21's. To say otherwise is naive.

That is not the case:

2013
Dublin 2-20 Kildare 2-7
Kildare 0-10 Tyrone 1-13
Cork 1-9 Kildare 2-10
Mayo 0-13 Kildare 1-11

2014
Dublin 1-22 Kildare 1-12
Kildare 1-21 Tyrone 3-16
Cork 0-16 Kildare 1-12
Kildare 2-19 Mayo 2-18

Unsure of what point you are trying to make kickingking but by my calculations without consulting Ohtoohtobe's niece it amounts to 2 wins and 4 points out of 4 in 2013 to 1 win and 2 points out of 4 in 2014.

Defensively from those 4 games we've conceded 6-72 so far in 2014.
4-55 from the same set of games in 2013.

It's irrelevant what we've scored in either year what matters is if we've scored more than the opposition and we've failed to do that 3 out of 4 times so far.

So we're worse off whatever way you look at it.

Got there before me WW.

2014 Played 4 lost 3  2 points

2013 played 4 won 3. 6 points

Kerry making light work of Tyrone.

James O'Donoghue will take some watching.

Jesus Kerry hammering Tyrone now 2 15 to 0 09 points, trying to remain positive but it doesn't look good for us, them 2 goals last week looked to have killed us  

Jaysus just want to say James O'Donaghoe is some player.

So much for Kerry being on the skids

How's those two wins from three looking now. Westmeath beating Mayo as well. Great stuff.

Mayo will beat Westmeath . And by my calculations we'll be in the bottom 2.

Kerry is now a must win or relegation.