Kildare v Tyrone

Ah Baba we've had this old debate before on a previous thread, I've really no intrest in engaging in it again. I make a point you call names, I make another point you call names. I decided after our last encounter to wait about seven years untill your at least twenty before I'll debate anything with you again, now you'll have to excuse me duty calls

Its a forum with different views, so expect others to disagree with you.
Baba, you started this thread, just wondering what you thought of the overall performance and not just the last 2 mins which we all agree were catastrophic.

TommyKeegan wrote:

Ah Dinny, love your posts, but you are quoting a man who thought if you weren't a politician you shouldn't interfere. So fair enough, I shouldn't talk about intercounty football having been nowhere near it. But by that logic no one here should be allowed a view on politics, film or music, cause you haven't made it. Sums up an self-protecting opinion from the confirmed racist Teddy was! Just that pathetic argument really angers me, and you're above it. But it's cool, presume you won't watch an ounce of commentary on any channel of Ukraine or a moment of analysis of any sport from a non ex-player. Just presume you stand by the quote, not just when it suits.

Of course I stand by the quote, I want this Kildare team to be that mentally strong that they can believe in the culture McGeeney built and that they Jason Ryan will hopefully build on.  From the teams perspective I would see absolutely zero benefit in the destructive criticism that is been thrown at them over 90 seconds of madness. You are probably aware of the participation model, lifestyle, mental, tactical, physical, technical. Well the mental side touches all the others and I think mentally we are very strong, Kildare under McGeeney were a championship team in attitude until last year. I think we suffered tactically (after Grimley left) and technically and I think those are Ryan's strengths and hopefully he can build on these.

So when have Kildare ever collapsed like that before? These players should tremendous character to win the game against Mayo in injury time with the last kick, where does that fit into the narrative of mentally weak unable to finish out games?

As for Teddy,the Americans think enough of him to have him on Mount Rushmore and to judge him as a racist is to ignore that America 100 years ago was vastly different from America today. Needless to say I am not going into American Culture and politics on a GAA forum I bore people enough. As for the Ukraine, Crimea was always a ticking time bomb ever since Khrushchev gave it away but everyone seems to have an angle on it so trying to decipher informed opinion is pretty hard.

As for informed articulate journalist v someone like Colm Parkinson- it's Wooly everyday*



*joke

See young Donnelly saying on h/s that the last time he remembered a finish like that was at u/14, the last i can recall was man u v b munich but then those germans are known to be mentally weak. They lost 2 world wars from winning positions 2. Only joking lads don't get upset

murof wrote:

Its a forum with different views, so expect others to disagree with you.
Baba, you started this thread, just wondering what you thought of the overall performance and not just the last 2 mins which we all agree were catastrophic.

Nice to see some one engaging like an adult.

Overall you have to say the lads played very well. We are delivery good quick ball into the forwards and it's reaping the rewards. Over the last couple of years the play it seemed was to bash it into O'Connor and hope for the best.
the ball he scored the goal of was typical. No high lofty ball that he could have a cup of tea before it hit the earth. This was accurate and low, he thrives on it and it showed.

It's the defence you would have to worry about. Second worst in the Country and no signs of the individual mistakes that have cost us so dear being eliminated.

Having seen what I have seen I would be more optimistic than I was, but and it's a big but. It could all go wrong very easy. Saturday will be a sever test. As long as we don't wilt like last year I'll take it as a positive and move on to the make or break Kerry game.

Having said all that it in no way excuses the last 90 seconds, which was as bad as it gets. The history books will read another Tyrone win against Kildare.

Most of our defense problems are due to the really poor form of Foley and McGrillen. Add in the poor kickouts of Connolly on occassions and you can see why teams can run through us so often.
On the positive side we seem to have unearthed 2 good ones in Murnaghan and O'Grady and still have Doyle, Lyons and Kelly to come back and possibly Dan Flynn.
Midfield has been a problem for many years but the trio of Hurley, White and Moolick have really improved us. Someone here was laughed at a few weeks ago when they said Moolick would be ahead of Daryl Flynn this season, doesn't look so silly now does it.

That was me who was laughed at Murof. To be fair I also thought Fogarty would get ahead of TOC and Tiernan might get in as well so one 1 out of 3 ain't a great return. Still think Fogarty a better long term scoring bet than Tomas but hard to argue that one at the moment!

Good to see more rounded views come in.
Jesus I thought TK was getting away with too much for someone who listened to every second of the game. How he did it from so far away I'll never understand or was it that internet thing he was on???
We all know he has a personal gripe for the new manager. His opinion is therfore a bias one and deserves less credit than someone with an even and rational perspective who saw the whole game in person without the need for commentary.
One thing for sure is that the players have put in some good work this year and we have not gone away for the simple reason there are a lot of talented footballers in Kildare striving to compete at the very highest level of their sport and Jason Ryan has taken over from Mcgeeney and is attempting to build on what has gone before.
Tyrone have made no bones about the fact that they are trying to adopt a new approach to the game a more attacking one, it is obvious we are too. The game has evolved even in the last two years, couple that with the Black card rule and you get alot of high scoring particularly in the league.

Very silly 90 seconds at the end but enough has being said about that already.

For the majority of the game we did the right thing. We did kick in some silly ball to the forwards in the second half and we will have to cut this out completely. For me O'Connor has stepped it up a gear in recent games and it is great to see however I am not sure he is the man to complement Brophy as a two man full forward line. His best work is in the box but that leaves Brophy the only option at times for the lads kicking the ball in.
I have not being the biggest fans of the work rate of Moolick and Hurley at times but the lads seem to be giving it their all at the moment. I really hope they cope with the open space on Saturday night against the Dubs as I believe that is the biggest test as no other team runs as much as them.
IMO this was a huge step up from the performance we showed against Cork and if that continues I believe we will be able to stay in Div 1.

Crofter wrote:

That was me who was laughed at Murof. To be fair I also thought Fogarty would get ahead of TOC and Tiernan might get in as well so one 1 out of 3 ain't a great return. Still think Fogarty a better long term scoring bet than Tomas but hard to argue that one at the moment!

You should have seen the response I got when I suggested Darroch Mulhall deserved a chance. Also, I remember when McGeeney started Niall Kelly in the O'Byrne Cup final last year, there were people going ballistic on Facebook, and I was saying, "No - that's a really good move!" Not to get too Athy-centric - and before anyway asks, I'm not from Athy and I don't support them - but Cian Reynolds and James Eaton should be given an opportunity too. And anyone who jumps down my throat, I'll simply refer them to the Mulhall and Kelly examples. I would rate Eaton and Reynolds up there with those two.

And yes - Fogarty should be starting instead of O'Connor. You saw from that mighty catch he made to set up a score that he has the ball winning ability, plus the skill. I mean, he scored four goals in one of the pre-season games, you wonder what he has to do... Anyway, Tomas is playing well atm, so fair play to him, but personally I would have Fogarty in there. Other than that, I wouldn't have much to argue with in Ryan's team selection, tbh.

The last minute was shocking, but I'd have to say we'd been cut open a few times during the game. Obviously a scenario like that is simply unacceptable - and the players will know - but I wonder if this is a bit of an occupational hazard when you have a more attacking style. You saw last year at times Dublin were basically shambolic at the back - including against us for the first 10 mins - and their scoring power got them over the line. Not saying our situation is exactly the same but I wouldn't hold my breath for a Donegal 2012-style defensive system.

Having said that, I would acknowledge that improvements can be made and the injury time events on Sun should never happen under any circumstances.

Is Reynolds still with Leitrim HG ?
I suppose it wouldnt be much of a Forum if we didnt have different views and opinions..
One thing I would agree with TK on is for us to continue to develope staying in Div 1 is so very important.

Not sure Seamus, but if he's available for Kildare he should definitely be given a chance.